Episode 41
Anchorage: Transit on the edge of the wilderness
Imagine running a transit system where moose crossing the road in town is just your average day. Where winters are long, dark and cold, but summer is hot and has 22 hours of daylight.
That's transit in Alaska.
In this first of two episodes from Alaska, Paul Comfort takes us to Anchorage. This week you'll hear from Jamie Acton, Executive Director of Public Transportation, and Bart Rudolph, Transit Planning & Communications Manager for the Municipality of Anchorage talking about the system and what it's like to be Alaskans.
Paul delves into what makes Anchorage's transit system unique, and the challenges they face with lowering emissions and alternative fuel sources. They also discuss Anchorage's active lifestyle, the U-Pass program for employers, and the communal spirit of Alaskans. Paul shares his reflections on the remarkable natural beauty and historic significance of Alaska, providing listeners with a gritty, on-the-scene experience.
Next week, we'll bring you part 2 from Fairbanks, the most Northern large city in the U.S., where the temperatures go from -60F in the winter to +95F in the summer.
Transit Unplugged is brought to you by Modaxo https://www.modaxo.com
- Host: Paul Comfort
- Producer: Paul Comfort
- Editor and Writer: Tris Hussey
- Executive Producer: Julie Gates
Special thanks to:
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- Social Media: Tatyana Mechkarova
- Marketing content, Transit Unplugged Newsletter, & transit puns: Tris Hussey
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0:00 Anchorage: Transit on the edge of the wilderness
00:05 Introduction to Transit Unplugged
01:24 Road Trip Series Overview
02:13 Personal Reflections on Alaska
03:37 History of Alaska: Seward's Folly
05:12 Anchorage Transit Insights
09:39 Challenges and Innovations in Anchorage Transit
13:06 Unique Aspects of Living in Alaska
18:02 Conclusion and Next Episode Preview
18:53 Coming up next week on Transit Unplugged
Disclaimer: The views and opinions expressed in this program are those of the guests, and do not necessarily reflect the views or positions of Modaxo Inc., its affiliates or subsidiaries, or any entities they represent (“Modaxo”). This production belongs to Modaxo, and may contain information that may be subject to trademark, copyright, or other intellectual property rights and restrictions. This production provides general information, and should not be relied on as legal advice or opinion. Modaxo specifically disclaims all warranties, express or implied, and will not be liable for any losses, claims, or damages arising from the use of this presentation, from any material contained in it, or from any action or decision taken in response to it.
Transcript
Hey, this is Paul Comfort.
Speaker:Welcome to Transit Unplugged.
Speaker:We're excited to bring you the first episode of our two part series in
Speaker:Alaska on today's podcast, but before we jump into it, I want to let you
Speaker:know about a cool, great award.
Speaker:Transit Unplugged just won.
Speaker:Transit 2024 Spotlight Award from the Southwest Transit Association,
Speaker:or SWATA, at its annual summer conference, along with co winner Kansas
Speaker:City Area Transportation Authority.
Speaker:The award honored the best electronic media collaboration
Speaker:between Transit Unplugged and KCATA.
Speaker:Which featured Kansas City's vibrant public transit system on an episode
Speaker:of Transit Unplugged TV and two Transit Unplugged podcasts featuring
Speaker:Frank White, CEO of KCATA, and Tom Gerend who is Executive Director of
Speaker:the Kansas City Streetcar Authority.
Speaker:We're super excited to pick up the award in person down there in Fort
Speaker:Worth, and we are very grateful to SWATA for this recognition.
Speaker:They do such a good job of keeping our agencies connected.
Speaker:Rich Sampson, the Executive Director, Amanda Webb, the whole
Speaker:team there does such a great job.
Speaker:The Transit Unplugged team looks forward to telling more stories
Speaker:about the great transit systems around the globe and to shine a light
Speaker:on our mission critical industry.
Speaker:I want to thank all the people on our team.
Speaker:who are part of Transit Unplugged, who have helped make this
Speaker:possible, and now onto the podcast.
Speaker:This episode of Transit Unplugged is different than a lot of
Speaker:the ones we've done recently.
Speaker:It's part of a three part series where we went on a road trip to the western part of
Speaker:the United States, starting in Sacramento, California, which was last week's podcast.
Speaker:This week, it's in Anchorage, Alaska, and next week will be the northernmost
Speaker:large city in America, Fairbanks.
Speaker:All these podcasts are recorded on scene, meaning, you know, we're
Speaker:not, in somebody's office somewhere.
Speaker:We're out walking the yards of their transit facilities, and
Speaker:we're talking about things, and, it has a real gritty feel to it.
Speaker:I think you'll love them.
Speaker:they're very interesting.
Speaker:We've done them kind of a story format as well, where I come in, between
Speaker:portions of the interview where we move around and kind of talk to you about
Speaker:what's going on behind the scenes.
Speaker:You can watch all of this on our Transit Unplugged TV,
Speaker:shows that we've recorded here.
Speaker:One in Sacramento, one in Anchorage, and one in Fairbanks.
Speaker:Let's talk about this trip to Alaska for a minute.
Speaker:I want to share with you some personal reflections.
Speaker:I have never been to Alaska, and so I've always wanted to go there.
Speaker:Unfortunately, I wasn't able to see the Northern Lights because
Speaker:they only show more in the colder months, but kind of happy not to
Speaker:be there in the 40 degree weather.
Speaker:This was summertime.
Speaker:We visited in July.
Speaker:And, uh, we had just come from Sacramento, where the temperature was 112 degrees.
Speaker:I visited Folsom Prison while I was there outside, and I think I got
Speaker:a little, overheated there, so it was great to come into Alaska with
Speaker:temperatures in the 60s and 70s.
Speaker:the day we got, into Anchorage, it was, pouring down rain.
Speaker:So, we still went outside and did a bunch of fun things with
Speaker:the local transit executives.
Speaker:But it was a great relief.
Speaker:Actually, it was a very nice rain.
Speaker:I enjoyed it.
Speaker:The whole time in Alaska, just the nature's bounty there is like nothing
Speaker:I've ever felt or seen before.
Speaker:As I went up to Fairbanks, we took a 12 hour ride between the
two cities:and got into there.
two cities:The sunshine, the crisp air, low humidity was great for summer.
two cities:You know, I'm from near Annapolis, Maryland, where we have really humid
two cities:summers, July and August especially, and so it was great to be there with everyone,
two cities:as well as here in Anchorage, and it just made me, the whole experience was very
two cities:warm and welcoming, the folks were there, and the beauty and the warmth just seemed
two cities:to harken back to an earlier era, and I wanted to take a moment to reflect on
two cities:the history of Alaska, just for a minute.
two cities:Have you ever heard of the term Seward's Folly?
two cities:Remember that Alaska was actually part of Russia, for a long time,
two cities:and, uh, there was a Secretary of State named William Seward.
two cities:He was Secretary of State during Abraham Lincoln's tenure, and he had been
two cities:negotiating with Russia and actually wanted to purchase, the state of Alaska.
two cities:It wasn't a state then, obviously, the territory of Alaska, from Russia,
two cities:but then the Civil War happened and they couldn't focus on it then.
two cities:So in 1867, just after the close of the Civil War, William Seward, the
two cities:Secretary of State, negotiated this transaction with Russia for only 7.
two cities:2 million, which equated to roughly only two cents an acre.
two cities:But at the time, can you believe it?
two cities:Many Americans saw the purchase as a waste of resources, calling it,
two cities:quote, Seward's Folly, or Seward's Icebox, believing that the land
two cities:was, you know, barren and useless.
two cities:But it was just a couple decades later when they discovered gold.
two cities:There's gold in them thar hills, is what they would say.
two cities:We actually got to see places where the gold was dug up from.
two cities:I went on a boat tour, with Jaime Cuadra, our videographer, for a three hour
two cities:tour, like Gilligan's Island, you know.
two cities:but we came back safe and, it was along the river.
two cities:up there in Fairbanks, and the guy told us, the tour guide told us,
two cities:down this one river here, they found the equivalent of seven billion
two cities:dollars in today's money of gold.
two cities:So, a lot of gold came out of there, and then, of course, later on, they
two cities:discovered oil, which was called black gold, because of its value.
two cities:And then, of course, later on during World War II, the state had
two cities:great strategic importance and it eventually silenced all the critics.
two cities:Some people will still use the term Seward's Folly to, you know, to talk about
two cities:something kind of tongue in cheek, right?
two cities:Initially, people are skeptical, but later on, they realize the deal has great value.
two cities:So, this deal had great value.
two cities:so, first let's go on to Anchorage.
two cities:as I mentioned, this was a rainy Saturday morning.
two cities:I sat down at a local coffee shop with Jamie Acton and Bart Rudolph, to talk
two cities:about their city, and their transit, and what it's like for them living in Alaska.
two cities:Jamie Acton is a native of Alaska, and she's the Executive Director
two cities:of Public Transportation, and Bart Rudolph is a transplant there,
two cities:but wants to spend the rest of his life, he is the Transit Planning
two cities:Manager for the City of Anchorage.
two cities:Anchorage, is the largest city in Alaska, home to around 290, 000 people,
two cities:which is about nine times larger than the next largest city of Fairbanks.
two cities:Their transit system is part of the city government.
two cities:and has a service area of 77 square miles, which is pretty big, with fixed
two cities:route, paratransit, and microtransit.
two cities:Jamie was born and raised in Anchorage, and she went away to school in Oregon,
two cities:but came back after college, and, like many of us, kind of fell, into, and
two cities:in love with, public transportation.
two cities:Bart came to Alaska 14 years ago.
two cities:He said he'd stay for just a couple years, but he's never left.
two cities:Bart went to college in Kansas City.
two cities:And worked at the MPO there, the Metropolitan Planning Agency, and is
two cities:friends with our previous guest, Tom Garand, who heads up the streetcar there.
two cities:They actually both started at the agency around the same time, which shows you
two cities:how small the transit world is, you know?
two cities:Anyway, I started out asking Jamie and Bart over coffee how
two cities:they got their start in transit.
two cities:You know, I think like a lot of people, I fell into transit.
two cities:Transit found me.
two cities:I actually, just responded to a job opportunity and it
two cities:was for a mobility program.
two cities:I had no idea what that meant, and then quickly learned that it had everything
two cities:to do with anything that walked or rolled, and so, quickly learned that,
two cities:I had a heart for transit and, and saw that everyday value in, you know, being
two cities:able to help people get to where they needed to go throughout our community.
two cities:Bart, tell me a little about your background and how
two cities:you got into what you do.
two cities:I have an MPO background, so I was the MPO coordinator between the Department
two cities:of Transportation and the MPO here, and through those relationships, the transit
two cities:director at the time recruited me to come over to transit, so again, I was
two cities:doing road planning, I was doing aviation planning at DOT, which was really fun, but
two cities:was convinced to start transit planning and decided that I really liked it.
two cities:I liked the immediate effect it had.
two cities:I liked the interaction with the people and not planning for a road
two cities:that was going to be built in 15 years.
two cities:Yeah, yeah.
two cities:You know.
two cities:And did you used to work in Kansas City?
two cities:We used to work in Kansas City.
two cities:I went to college in Kansas City.
two cities:That's where I got my degree at, the University of Missouri, Kansas City.
two cities:And then the MPO, Mark, really got my footings there.
two cities:And you're with Tom Gerend there, you told me.
two cities:Yeah, Tom started around the same time I did.
two cities:He was leading the transit program there at the time.
two cities:Very interesting.
two cities:Now he heads up the Kansas City streetcar.
two cities:You know, it's a small world.
two cities:He's done great things for Kansas City.
two cities:And it's amazing what Kansas City has done in the last few years.
two cities:But the streetcar is amazing and it's just amazing.
two cities:forever expanding.
two cities:I'm glad it's reaching the university now.
two cities:And on a funny note, because Alaska is so huge, it's twice the size of Texas.
two cities:570, 640 square miles.
two cities:It doesn't look like it on a map or on a globe, but neither does
two cities:Australia look as big as it really is.
two cities:But anyway, yeah, it's very large, and they have a close knit family,
two cities:and they stay in touch throughout the year, in the transit industry.
two cities:But it might only be in person at events like APTA, because it's such a big
two cities:state, which takes place in the lower 48.
two cities:How does it work between all the different cities public transit systems?
two cities:Do you all have a good association?
two cities:You work together well?
two cities:Yeah, so we actually don't have a state association, but it is such a small
two cities:network that, you know, I'm great friends with the Valley Transit, you know,
two cities:CEO, I, you know, talk to the people in Juneau regularly and Ketchikan, you
two cities:know, yeah, it's, it's a small, Network, tight knit very, very much, you know, as
two cities:being the largest, uh, fish in the pond.
two cities:Yes.
two cities:you know, we, we definitely actually do reach out to each other, you
two cities:know, very regularly and there's things that are going on in the
two cities:smaller systems that I'm like, oh.
two cities:Yeah, maybe we should take a look at that.
two cities:And then, you know, they're also always pinging, you know, us.
two cities:What's Anchorage doing?
two cities:Yeah.
two cities:Yeah, that's good.
two cities:It's also kind of funny because our state is so large, we see
two cities:them more at conferences in the lower 48 than we Yeah, yeah.
two cities:Like, we'll run into Michelle.
two cities:Michelle.
two cities:At APTA.
two cities:All the time.
two cities:Yeah.
two cities:Yeah.
two cities:That's always kind of comical.
two cities:It's like, oh, hey, I haven't seen you, but you're eight hours away.
two cities:Yeah.
two cities:But here we are in Portland.
two cities:Right.
two cities:I asked Jamie about her agency, how many buses she ran, and most importantly, how
two cities:they were dealing with lowering emissions.
two cities:As you know, battery electric buses face a lot of challenges in cold weather.
two cities:And then I asked Bart about his rideshare program and plans for microtransit.
two cities:do.
two cities:So, we actually still run diesel buses.
two cities:our entire, fixed route fleet is, is coming in.
two cities:Ultra Low Sulfur Clean Diesel.
two cities:We have just recently completed the second round of three purchases that are
two cities:coming online to do replacements that will basically turn our fleet over by
two cities:about 50% So yeah, we, you know, at this point we, we know that we need to start
two cities:looking at an alternative fuel source, but right now, you know, whether that's CNG,
two cities:whether that's hydrogen, whether that's, you know, Battery electric vehicles, you
two cities:know, we're just not quite there yet.
two cities:Have you piloted anything?
two cities:Have you tried other alternative technologies?
two cities:Yeah, so in 2017, 2018, there was a battery electric, pilot,
two cities:that we actually did pilot.
two cities:Did run for a short period of time.
two cities:there was definitely some challenges with that, in our, in our winter climate.
two cities:So, you know, the state really, some of the other agencies
two cities:have gone to alternative fuels.
two cities:you know, I think when you're up in Fairbanks, you'll probably
two cities:get to see their, their CNG.
two cities:Yeah, compressed natural gas, right?
two cities:Yeah.
two cities:Yeah, their CNG facilities.
two cities:And then, you know, down in Juneau, where they have a little more moderate climate,
two cities:they, they went with battery electric.
two cities:also not without their challenges.
two cities:So, you know, as we look to turn our fleet over, yeah, we're going
two cities:to do it in a way that best suits our climate, our riders needs.
two cities:Yeah.
two cities:So what do you got, since you're the planner, what do you got in the pipeline?
two cities:well, you know we're late to the game, but we're talking microtransit.
two cities:Okay.
two cities:And our system redevelopment in 2017 provided a lot of gaps in the system.
two cities:We really went towards the ridership model, not the coverage model.
two cities:And so we've been exploring ways to kind of fill those gaps.
two cities:And so we're just now kind of ready to expand or embark on microtransit in some
two cities:of the less populated parts of the city.
two cities:Like a lot of cities, Anchorage is trying to encourage more commuters onto transit
two cities:or rideshare, rather than just drive.
two cities:And while a lot of agencies And cities have specific UA programs
two cities:for university and college students, and Anchorage BART expanded, the
two cities:UA program to employers as well.
two cities:I asked him to tell us a bit about how it works and who he's working with.
two cities:It's a very interesting concept.
two cities:we have a U PASS program, which started out as a university program because,
two cities:you know, The UAA, University of Alaska Anchorage, started it about 28 years ago.
two cities:We've had this partnership with them and then we've expanded it to
two cities:a universal program where we start.
two cities:Adding more businesses and partnerships.
two cities:So the goal is to expand that, and that's part of our long range plan.
two cities:Right now we have partnerships with oil companies like ConocoPhillips,
two cities:the hospitals, Providence, even Denali Universal Partnership Program,
two cities:different employers across the city.
two cities:So we're working on expanding that partnership.
two cities:And really starting to build a relationship, with everyone in the
two cities:city to talk about not just the U PASS program, but also the benefits
two cities:of transit, so that when we pass bonds and, you know, we talk about expanding
two cities:service, even if someone's never ridden the bus, they understand the value to
two cities:their, employees or things like that yeah
two cities:so so basically it's that an employer would buy passes for their employees
two cities:so they don't have to pay the daily fare they just show their badge and
two cities:they're good to go is that how it
two cities:works yep it's simple and easy it's it's a mandatory program that all
two cities:employees have you know that they just show the pass and you know hopefully it
two cities:would encourage them to take a ride on transit that they maybe never would have
two cities:I learned a lot of fun facts about Alaska and Anchorage while talking with them.
two cities:Like, residents of Alaska are eligible to receive money from something
two cities:called the Alaska Permanent Fund Dividend, which comes from interest
two cities:earned on oil and gas revenues.
two cities:You might have heard of it.
two cities:I've heard of it before, but they described it to
two cities:me in a little more detail.
two cities:I also learned that in Anchorage, you're only ever 15 minutes away
two cities:from being in the wilderness.
two cities:Some people say in Anchorage, you're 15 minutes away from Alaska.
two cities:what it means is, you're very close to just being out in the wilderness.
two cities:And the transit system is geared, literally.
two cities:to support their active lifestyle.
two cities:people say Anchorage is 15 minutes away from Alaska, so we What does that mean?
two cities:In 15 minutes you can be in complete wilderness, you can be completely
two cities:solitude, on a trail, hiking, you can go anywhere you want in the
two cities:backcountry, So we do a lot of hiking, a lot of camping, lot of biking, you
two cities:know, things that I never thought I would be doing from Kansas City.
two cities:Yeah.
two cities:All of our buses are outfitted with fat tire bike racks.
two cities:Three place fat tire bike racks.
two cities:Because people are biking all year round now.
two cities:And so, we have a great, amazing trail system within
two cities:the municipality of Anchorage.
two cities:And we have the Moose Loop Trail.
two cities:And it literally, if you are to ride it and track it on the on the GPS or
two cities:whatnot, it forms the head of a moose.
two cities:I found that most people that I talk to that live in Alaska
two cities:have a very special quality.
two cities:And since Jamie was born there, I asked her about that.
two cities:What is it like living in Alaska?
two cities:What's so different about it than the lower 48?
two cities:As they call us down here in the lower 48 states.
two cities:Yeah, you know, Alaska has some of the most, hearty people that I've ever been
two cities:around, but also friendly and kind.
two cities:there is a very much of a, we support ourselves and this, you know, idea of
two cities:how do Alaskans support each other.
two cities:Each other, to get through the winters, to get through things like major earthquakes.
two cities:You almost have to do that, right?
two cities:Yeah, you know.
two cities:Everybody's brothers and sisters, right?
two cities:Exactly.
two cities:Yeah,
two cities:we definitely, you know, reach out and support each other, however we can.
two cities:We had a major earthquake in 2018, and that was one of the messages
two cities:that really came out, you know, through the emergency management
two cities:system is, Check on your neighbors.
two cities:Check on, you know, check on your family.
two cities:Make sure everybody's okay and has what they need and, so that's just,
two cities:I think, a mentality that's very different here, you know, you can walk
two cities:down the street and see somebody and smile and say hi and they'll respond.
two cities:While I was in Anchorage in July, there were still almost
two cities:21 hours a day of daylight.
two cities:I woke up one night, in the early morning and, we were staying in a
two cities:bed and breakfast and the light from outside coming in the window was
two cities:just like, you know, the middle of the day here at home in Maryland.
two cities:Just wild.
two cities:but in the wintertime, they get as little as four to six hours of daylight and it
two cities:stays close to the horizon as it goes up.
two cities:That's in December.
two cities:I asked Jamie and Bart what that was like.
two cities:Yeah, so we just had summer solstice, June 21st, the longest day of the year.
two cities:Was that 22
two cities:hours of daylight?
two cities:I
two cities:believe we logged just under 20, 21.
two cities:yeah, so, when I flew in last night, it was still daylight,
two cities:just like you were saying.
two cities:And, It gets a little dusky, but it doesn't quite get dark, but we are
two cities:starting to lose daylight now, you know, since solstice has passed.
two cities:And then when
two cities:it's really in the middle of winter, You don't have hardly any daylight, right?
two cities:What do you got?
two cities:You, you go to work in the dark, you come home in the dark.
two cities:Yeah.
two cities:and it, it essentially, oh gosh, at the, at the height of, of that, we're, you're
two cities:looking at four to six hours of daylight.
two cities:Four to six hours of daylight.
two cities:Wow.
two cities:Extremes.
two cities:So if you don't, yeah, if you don't get out in it.
two cities:You don't see it.
two cities:Yeah.
two cities:It is kind of my favorite part of the day is the local radio station here
two cities:tells you the daylight every day as they sign off, they're like, and today's
two cities:daylight is, and so I know exactly right now we have 18 hours and 45 minutes.
two cities:okay.
two cities:Very cool.
two cities:Yeah.
two cities:And so, we start gaining very rapidly, but then you lose very
two cities:rapidly as well, and those swings are, you know, pretty dramatic.
two cities:And that
two cities:impacts, I'm sure, the bus drivers, and tell me about that.
two cities:How does that impact them?
two cities:Yeah.
two cities:I
two cities:mean, you definitely see it.
two cities:you see it in the, in the operators, you see it in the ridership.
two cities:you know, when, when the light starts to come out, all Alaskans, it's
two cities:like, oh my gosh, you got to get out and enjoy every moment of it.
two cities:You know, people are out mowing their lawns at 11 o'clock at night.
two cities:Oh, yeah.
two cities:You know, you're yelling at kids to come inside from playing.
two cities:It's, you know, it's time to go to bed.
two cities:Yeah, when, when us
two cities:in the lower 48 got our kids in at 8 p.
two cities:m.
two cities:Yeah, you know, you're,
two cities:you're, you're hauling people in, you know, all hours of the
two cities:day, because it's still light.
two cities:But then, you know, in the winter, it's.
two cities:and it's dark and it's cold and it's hard and some people it
two cities:does impact their mental health.
two cities:Yeah, I'm sure.
two cities:Got a
two cities:lot of sun lamps up here I'm sure.
two cities:A lot of the
two cities:lamps, a lot of vitamin D.
two cities:And like we were saying, if you have If you don't have a chance to get
two cities:out during the middle of the day, you know, you really have to make an
two cities:active effort to make that happen.
two cities:it was great sitting down with Jamie and Bart, and like all cities,
two cities:transit plays a crucial role in the lives of everyone in Anchorage.
two cities:Coming up next week, I'll have part two of my Alaskan adventure with
two cities:interviews in the city of Fairbanks, and I guess, again, you will, really
two cities:see the difference and hear the difference as we do these in person.
two cities:And next week, again, is all over the place.
two cities:Walking and talking at facilities out in nature and in open fields where
two cities:they're telling me about permafrost.
two cities:It's just phenomenal.
two cities:Make sure you listen to that podcast as well.
two cities:And again, as I mentioned, If you haven't subscribed yet to Transit
two cities:Unplugged TV, you really should.
two cities:We're doing these, compendium podcasts now when I do the visits there, so you
two cities:can get a little more in depth than we're able to do on TV on the podcast,
two cities:but then you can watch the show and kind of see everything you heard about.
two cities:I think you'll really enjoy it.
two cities:I'm hearing from a lot of people who really enjoy this approach.
two cities:Thanks again for sticking with us here on Transit Unplugged.
two cities:Thanks for listening to this week's episode of transit unplugged and thank
two cities:you to our guests, Jimmy Acton and Bart Rudolph for making it possible.
two cities:I'm Tris Hussey editor of the podcast.
two cities:And I've been to Alaska several times, including a stint as an archeologist.
two cities:And just as Paul said, it's an amazing part of the world to visit.
two cities:Highly recommended.
two cities:Now coming up next week, we're staying in Alaska for part two
two cities:of this series from Fairbanks.
two cities:In this episode, you'll learn how the geology of the area
two cities:influenced the entire city.
two cities:Even how they build their roads.
two cities:Transit Unplugged is brought to you by Modaxo.
two cities:At Modaxo we're passionate about moving the world's people and at
two cities:Transit Unplugged, we're passionate about telling those stories.
two cities:So until next week, ride safe and ride happy.
