What if public transit agencies drove housing policy?

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Did you know that the price of houses in Canada

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has doubled in the last decade?

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And what's that got to do with public transportation?

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We'll answer those questions on today's episode of Transit Unplugged.

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I'm Paul Comfort, and Marco D'Angelo, the CEO of the Canadian Urban Transit

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Association spoke with me about this housing study and the conference that we

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were at recently in Edmonton, the CU TA in an in person interview we conducted there.

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This I think you'll find fascinating to see the role of housing and public

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transportation and the interplay between them on this interview.

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I also had the opportunity to speak in person with Mike Bismeyer who

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you may have heard many times on our podcast over the last couple years

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talking about kindness and mentorship.

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He and I got to speak on that topic together at the CUTA Conference in

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Edmonton and he shares a few thoughts on the subject and kind of how he got started

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on this as a young person being bullied.

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At an interview I conducted with him on the trade show

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floor of the CUDA conference.

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This is the first of three episodes of Transit Unplugged, which were

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conducted at the CUTA conference.

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Next week, we'll have Eddie Robar, the deputy city manager of Edmonton and

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Carrie Hotten McDonald, the manager of Edmonton Transit, talking about

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hydrogen power, their large battery electric bus garage there, and much more.

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And the following week.

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We interview Arthur Nicolette, CEO of Transdev Canada, one of the largest

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contractors there in the nation.

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Now, it's time for our interview with Marco D'Angelo, talking about

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the CUTA conference and housing.

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Great to be at the CUTA conference here in Edmonton, Canada, the Canadian

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Urban Transit Association, their big conference, and excited to have the CEO

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with me, my good friend, Marco D'Angelo.

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Thanks for being back with us.

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Marco D'Angelo: My pleasure, Paul.

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Nice to see you.

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Thanks for making the trip up here.

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Yeah, awesome.

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I love, Edmonton's a cool city, right?

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We've always heard about it.

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I've always heard about Edmonton Oilers and Wayne Gretzky, the kid here.

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This is, like they said, the most populous city, right, above the highest...

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Over a million people, latitude wise?

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Marco D'Angelo: Certainly in the northern hemisphere.

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I mean, I'm trying to think of, you know, what, where Moscow is on that.

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Yeah, oh no, I think it's in the western hemisphere.

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Marco D'Angelo: In the western hemisphere.

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So it's a big city.

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Yes.

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I didn't know what to expect when I got here, but great to be here.

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You've got a big audience here, nice crowd.

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Yes.

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Tell us about the conference here, the CUTA conference.

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Marco D'Angelo: Uh, well, it's our annual conference.

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We, uh, we hold two per year, and this one is, uh, special because it also includes

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a large, uh, transit, uh, expo and trade show, and that'll be coming up tomorrow.

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That's good.

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And you had a youth summit.

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Tell us about that.

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I got the.

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I didn't speak at that the other day.

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It was fun.

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Marco D'Angelo: Oh, that's great to hear.

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It was our 7th Youth Summit on Sustainable Urban Transportation and it was hosted

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at McEwen University just down the road from us here at the conference.

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Very happy to bring together 60, 65 youth from across Canada, every

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region of the country, to learn about, uh, about sustainability.

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Urban planning and meeting and networking with professionals and finding

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out about the careers of tomorrow.

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In fact, it's the 20th anniversary of the first Youth Summit way back in 2004.

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I was lucky enough to be, uh, helping to organize that.

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So 20 years later, it's a really great...

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It's a great thing to, uh, to see a full generation of people

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that attended that youth summit.

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Our first vice chair at CUTA and the General Manager of Halifax

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Transit, Dave Riege, he also attended that first youth summit.

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So really, there's a lot of, uh, a lot of knowledge and we've

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really benefited from engaging youth, uh, over the last 20 years.

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That's great.

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And we need more young people getting into industry, don't we?

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Marco D'Angelo: We certainly do.

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Like, uh, like every other industry, there's, uh, there's,

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there's competing, uh, job market.

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We are looking to diversify and build the workforce that we have for public transit.

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And so having transit and the careers that support it be a choice for folks that are,

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uh, going through, their education and offering mentorships and apprenticeships

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and bringing in engineers and training.

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These are many of the different ways in Canada that we are engaging with

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young people to invite them and choose transit as a career path for them.

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Let's talk about CUTA a little bit more so.

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For those in America, people are familiar with APTA, and they may not

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be as familiar with CUTA, but you're very similar organizations, right?

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You just represent Canada.

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Marco D'Angelo: Yes, very similar indeed.

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representing manufacturers, local transit agencies, the businesses

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that support them, and governments and associations across the country

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that share similar values to us.

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So very much like the American Public Transit Association.

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And what are you working on lately?

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Marco D'Angelo: We've been working on a few things.

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We've been working on...

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on a new housing report that was released last month.

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And housing affordability is a little bit different than in the United States.

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Over the last decade, house prices have doubled in Canada.

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Doubled?

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Doubled.

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And so it's a bit different than in the United States where it's been, it has been

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increasing, but at a more gradual pace.

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And this has led to quite a bit of inflation in Canada.

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So as, you know, interest rates have been going up in Canada and the United States,

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It's risen actually more in Canada to try to, uh, to cool down the economy and cap

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fast rising home prices and that's making, uh, life less and less affordable for

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many Canadians and this is why we think it's really the time to present transit

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as an answer, to helping Canadian families coming out of the pandemic, being able

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to afford the lifestyle that they need, uh, for themselves and their families.

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Wow, that's awesome.

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So tell me about, you did the study, it came out, what were the findings?

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Marco D'Angelo: Well, the findings were that we need to activate land.

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And so what that means is as capital projects are being built across the

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country, and we're very happy with the progress that we're making in building

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those, it's also very important that people who need to take transit and

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choose to take transit have affordable housing options that are near these great

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infrastructures that we're building.

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And so ensuring that there is affordability.

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ensuring that there's percentages of, uh, rental units that are

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being built, densifying around these transit hubs, around the hubs

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through transit oriented development, even on top of transit stations.

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We see that in, uh, in leading areas like in Vancouver

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certainly has been doing that.

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Oh yeah, Kevin showed me one of those when I was there.

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Okay.

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Yeah.

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Yeah, where you'd have, uh, basically a transit station that, that goes

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down into a metro, and above it would be, you know, an apartment tower or

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other, uh, retail infrastructure.

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And it really, these are what the most dense cities around the world do that

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have the highest modal shares for transit.

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Thinking about places like Singapore, where college and university campuses

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are a station onto themselves.

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And it's really a, uh, a way to, to move people around, to reduce congestion.

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To meet the greenhouse gas emissions target that Canada has, and also

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to provide equity, for people that are, uh, on modest, uh, incomes to

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participate in their community fully.

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Right, that makes sense.

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I thought it was interesting that the morning session this morning, you...

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Uh, Carrie Houghton McDonald, the CEO of the local transit

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system in Edmonton, interviewed a couple of city council people.

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And one of the guys was talking about how that, you know, our zoning rules and

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regulations really have a big determining factor on the affordability of housing.

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We've got to let people build smaller units and...

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So this is kind of what you're talking about, right?

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Changing policy.

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Marco D'Angelo: It is, and it's been, uh, moving across the country.

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So even, uh, another city, the city of Ottawa, on a building lot, you

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can now build up to four units, uh, where that wouldn't typically have

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been a single, family neighborhood.

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Yeah.

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An example in the US of course, is the state of California.

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Okay.

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Um, where, zoning is, has been open more broadly so that mul, it's easier to build

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multi-residential units on a plot of land.

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Now, you think about Canada, Canada has a lot of land.

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Yeah, you do.

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We do, and we've got good infrastructure that connects it.

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But where, where the rubber hits the road is in providing, an

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affordable lifestyle for Canadians.

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And that means...

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uh, using the land that we have in our urban communities more effectively,

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more efficiently, and that helps people to maybe have one car instead

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of two cars or shortens commutes, more time with, with loved ones, uh,

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and so these are the things that, as ridership has been returning.

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We're very happy that we're building these capital projects for tomorrow as well.

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Because we have a country of about 40 million people, but we

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estimate our transit infrastructure is built for 25 million people.

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Interesting.

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Alright, what's number two on your list?

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. Marco D'Angelo: In terms of, uh, our housing, uh, report, part of it, we deal

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with streamlining the approval process.

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And so that means prioritizing transit oriented development applications.

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Oh, yeah.

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The amount of time it takes to get simple things like a building permit,

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we've gotta bring those times down.

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And that's something that's within a municipality's jurisdiction in Canada.

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And that is, uh, presenting the plan, having it reviewed, a notice period, then

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there would be a variance type of meeting, uh, with it within the municipality

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where your neighbours would, uh, be able to comment and, and so these processes

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and then inspection after the fact, it really adds on quite a lot of time.

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So if you're building something as simple as an in law suite, or

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building a me a small house...

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on an existing property, the length of time that it takes for

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those small projects is very long.

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Now, scale that up to a large project, maybe a tower, replacing four single

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family homes, and you're going to build a 30 unit rental housing project.

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And so that could take up to a year.

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To get those, to get those, permits.

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And so we want to streamline that.

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Yeah.

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And then also make sure that we've got, the folks that do the actual construction.

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And so that gets back into, into the trades.

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And we, we heard today about that, uh, we have a shortage,

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in our trades in Canada as well.

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So there's a number of things that are hindering us to, uh,

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finding a way to provide affordable housing to more Canadians.

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That's awesome.

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Keep going.

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This is really interesting to me.

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But you don't think about this as the purview of transit agencies,

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but it really does impact our riders and what they do, so what's another

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recommendation from the study?

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Marco D'Angelo: Yeah, I would say that it's evolving the

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mandate of transit authorities.

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And let me, uh, an example that, uh, is in the report.

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Uh, back in 2020, the city of Saskatoon met, created a target of, uh, 50 percent

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of new housing be infill development.

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And so what that means is, um, building your neighborhood more densely.

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So in the city of Saskatoon, uh, one of their major projects is to create a bus

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rapid transit system and many cities across the prairies have been doing that.

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Uh, cities, uh, that are from 300 to 600, 000, I'm sure there's a.

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dozens of parallels in the United States, uh, that are, that are brought

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in these bus rapid transit corridors.

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And evolving a transit agency's mandate from a Canadian perspective would be

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not just building the transit within a corridor, it would be evolving to manage

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that land, uh, so that, uh, housing can be built at the same time as transit.

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So, that way, when a BRT or another capital project opens,

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You, right away, you have ridership that's ready to use that service.

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Oh, yeah.

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So, it helps to drive ridership and it helps to, also, connect people with

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their communities, uh, more easily.

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These are great housing recommendations coming from CUTA.

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Do you have one more you'd like to share?

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Marco D'Angelo: Yeah, one more.

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It's a, it's a location efficient mortgage.

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And so what that means is typically when a prospective homebuyer goes to their bank

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to, um, to borrow, to buy a house, the presumption is, is that homeowner also is

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buying a car or has a car, will buy a car.

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Okay.

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And so that occupies some amount of their credit and a location efficient mortgage.

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Because it'll be within a transit oriented community or development, it likely

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wouldn't have a parking spot, that way your debt ratio would seem lower and

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that would mean you'd be able to benefit perhaps from a slightly lower rate.

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Or be able to manage a slightly more expensive home because you wouldn't

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have payments associated, uh, with a car and the, and the things that come

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with a car, uh, and so we think that's another way to help, especially first

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time homebuyers enter the market.

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So what do you do with the study now?

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Are you going to take it to your legislature?

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Can you talk about that?

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Marco D'Angelo: Yes, certainly.

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It's one of the messages that we've brought to our federal government.

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In fact, it was launched in Ottawa, on Parliament Hill, so right

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where the House of Commons meets.

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Oh, wow.

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We were happy to be there.

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You, like, released this study there?

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Marco D'Angelo: We released the study, right in the House of Commons, actually.

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Yeah, it was, uh, one funny thing was, we booked a press conference

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room, and immediately before us was the Federal Minister of Housing

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holding a press conference on the need to have more affordable housing.

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And so it was meant to be on some level.

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You feel like you're making progress with it?

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Are they taking these recommendations and considering them?

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Marco D'Angelo: We do.

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We believe so.

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And, you know, we need to build about three and a half million

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additional homes by the year 2030.

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And that's just to maintain affordability for...

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For Canadians, but also we're welcoming about half a million new

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people to our country, every year.

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And so we need homes and, uh, and jobs and opportunities.

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And so we're making headway on that front.

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By bringing and welcoming half a million new Canadians, traffic is also a problem.

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And so building these homes...

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We need to make sure that the neighborhoods where the homes

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are being built aren't designed for the single occupancy vehicle.

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That we have transit for them on day one.

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That also means returning to the question of operating dollars.

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And so Canadian transit systems, we're at capacity in many of our cities,

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especially in the suburbs around our largest cities, like the greater

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Toronto area, the greater Montreal area.

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But the farebox revenue alone isn't...

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isn't able to keep up with the growing need for transit and the

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need for more transit and options uh, around these big cities.

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And so federal government decision makers are listening.

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At the provincial level, they're listening too.

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And we work, of course, all the time with, with city councils across Canada that work

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really directly with transit authorities.

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Wow.

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These are great recommendations, Marco.

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So, where can somebody find it?

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It's online at your website?

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Marco D'Angelo: It is.

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So it's online on the Canadian Urban Transit Association website.

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C U T A A C T U dot C A.

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So last question then is.

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What's coming?

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What do you see coming over the horizon, you know, for 2024 and beyond?

Paul Comfort: 00:14:39

Well, 2024, we think, will be an exciting year.

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Ridership has been returning across the country.

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We see a lot of new opportunities to engage with the public.

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We've opened a, Rail line around Montreal that it's owned by the public pension fund

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called the REM and so when it's complete there will be about 50 stations creating

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a loop around the greater Montreal area.

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That's very exciting and it's coming online.

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There's exciting projects in each region of the country to

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move towards electrification.

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Greening our fleets and finding ways through housing and densification, so that

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collectively these measures can help to tackle the 25 percent of greenhouse gas

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emissions, or GHGs, that Canada emits.

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And so that's one quarter, and if we can put a good dent into that, we'll

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be more on our way to meeting the climate targets that Canada has set.

Paul Comfort: 00:15:35

Wow, that's great.

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Well, great talking to you today, Marco.

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Great conference.

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Uh, you've got wonderful transit in this country, and I'm looking

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forward to seeing what comes next.

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Marco D'Angelo: Thank you very much, Paul.

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I'm with Mike Bismeyer.

Paul Comfort: 00:15:51

Mike, is, uh, Mike, great to be with you here on the, uh,

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on the show floor of CUTA.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:15:56

Well, thanks, Paul.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:15:57

It's great to have the Transit Unplugged team up here in Canada.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:15:59

We're super proud of our annual fall conference, and on behalf of CUTA and the

Mike Bismeyer: 00:16:03

business members, I'd like to thank you for taking the time to walk around all the

Mike Bismeyer: 00:16:06

booths and, uh, see all the new, uh, you know, exciting technology, and to, just

Mike Bismeyer: 00:16:10

to get to know our members here in Canada.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:16:11

I hope Edmonton's been treating you well.

Paul Comfort: 00:16:13

It has been a lot.

Paul Comfort: 00:16:14

You know, I think our listeners will recognize your voice from the times

Paul Comfort: 00:16:17

you talk about kindness and mentorship.

Paul Comfort: 00:16:19

You and I had the opportunity to do a big talk on the main stage on that this week.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:16:24

Yeah, it's been fantastic.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:16:25

It's been an exciting show.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:16:26

I mean, obviously, I'm heavily involved with the Young Emerging Leaders or Young

Mike Bismeyer: 00:16:29

Leaders Summit that we had ahead of CUTA.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:16:31

And, uh, it was great to have you invited in to speak to

Mike Bismeyer: 00:16:33

those, uh, leaders on Sunday.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:16:35

I had the opportunity to speak there as well.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:16:37

And then, obviously, rolling straight into CUTA, it's been a busy time,

Mike Bismeyer: 00:16:40

and, yeah, we did the opening session Monday morning, which was

Mike Bismeyer: 00:16:42

fantastic, a pleasure to be with you.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:16:44

But, yeah, it's great to be in front of our peers here.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:16:46

It's exciting.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:16:46

And, and for those that don't know, this is only our second trade show in Canada

Mike Bismeyer: 00:16:50

since COVID and things got back together.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:16:52

So really good attendance.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:16:53

People are excited to be out and about and talking to their peers.

Paul Comfort: 00:16:55

You know, Mike, you are one of the foremost advocates for kindness

Paul Comfort: 00:16:59

in our industry, and it's great to have you on our show talking about that, but

Paul Comfort: 00:17:03

I'm always struck by the story that you told with me on stage the other day about

Paul Comfort: 00:17:08

what got you really understanding the importance of kindness, because you had

Paul Comfort: 00:17:11

a moment early in your life Where someone was kind to you when you really needed it.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:17:15

Yeah, that's right.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:17:16

I mean, uh, and for those, you know, I, I always advocate about kindness

Mike Bismeyer: 00:17:19

and I am passionate about it.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:17:20

It's sort of a trait that runs in my family.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:17:22

I'm very fortunate.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:17:22

But yeah, I mean, uh, and people have probably heard the story before

Mike Bismeyer: 00:17:24

and, and pleased to reach out to me.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:17:26

I'm happy to talk about it.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:17:26

I, I, I keynote on it very often, but I was bullied.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:17:30

I had a year of school that was, was really not pleasant for me.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:17:33

Uh, and it was a random act of kindness that just changed my perspective on

Mike Bismeyer: 00:17:36

understanding that people were noticing things weren't right, and it happened on

Mike Bismeyer: 00:17:39

a school bus, which is maybe apropos, it was on a, on a mode of transportation, so.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:17:43

You know, and someone stepped up, what I call as an upstander,

Mike Bismeyer: 00:17:46

you know, they reached out.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:17:47

Tell us that story a little bit.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:17:48

Yeah, I was a young kid and, and, you know, I was a little bit overweight

Mike Bismeyer: 00:17:51

and my wonderful mom just kept saying, you know, you hadn't hit your growing

Mike Bismeyer: 00:17:53

spurt, but, uh, what really what was happening to me is, you know, I, I had

Mike Bismeyer: 00:17:56

a bus stop that was a few blocks from my house that I'd go to to catch the bus.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:17:59

It was between grade eight and nine back in those days, junior, junior high school.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:18:02

You know, I just happened to have a person that, uh, you know, uh,

Mike Bismeyer: 00:18:06

decided to make my life not pleasant.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:18:07

And, uh, you know, each day I'd show up at that bus stop and, You know, he'd

Mike Bismeyer: 00:18:10

grab my lunch in front of others and just tear it away from me, throw it in

Mike Bismeyer: 00:18:13

the garbage can, throw it on the floor.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:18:14

And what would he say to you?

Mike Bismeyer: 00:18:15

He'd make fun and say, you know, you don't need a meal today, you're fat enough.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:18:18

Yeah, it's terrible.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:18:19

Yeah, it's terrible, right?

Mike Bismeyer: 00:18:20

And you know, we don't know.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:18:21

For a young kid, man, that's going to affect you.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:18:23

You know, we don't know the impact words have on people.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:18:24

And you know, I internalized it for quite a while.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:18:26

I didn't really tell my parents about it.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:18:29

You know, but school was not pleasant.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:18:30

You know, I went in at different exits at the school.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:18:33

School, you know, I didn't want to, I did everything I could to not confront

Mike Bismeyer: 00:18:36

those guys, which then takes away from the education that you're there to

Mike Bismeyer: 00:18:39

learn about and your concentration.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:18:40

And I will say this, as much as I had a bad year, I can't

Mike Bismeyer: 00:18:43

imagine for kids nowadays.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:18:45

Like, for me, the saving grace...

Mike Bismeyer: 00:18:46

is when the bell went, it was over.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:18:48

There was no communication, no cell phones, and now the

Mike Bismeyer: 00:18:50

cyber bullying is non stop.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:18:52

I can't imagine, yeah, so, I got on the bus one day, and unbeknownst to

Mike Bismeyer: 00:18:56

me, this other, uh, other young student said to me, hey, you can sit with me,

Mike Bismeyer: 00:18:59

and, you know, I, I didn't have a lot of trust with people at the time, not

Mike Bismeyer: 00:19:02

outside of my group of friends, and, but I took the, I sat down, and, you

Mike Bismeyer: 00:19:06

know, I was, I, literally, we pulled away from the bus stop, and he just

Mike Bismeyer: 00:19:08

leaned over and said, you know, I got your back, and, uh, and I didn't know

Mike Bismeyer: 00:19:11

this student, it was someone I didn't know, but, uh, Uh, I didn't know what he

Mike Bismeyer: 00:19:14

meant by that, but he reached into his knapsack and had brought an extra lunch.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:19:18

And, you know, first of all, it was a massive random act of kindness, really,

Mike Bismeyer: 00:19:21

for someone else that was at a young age.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:19:23

But they knew something wasn't right, and probably told their parents.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:19:27

And it did two things, right?

Mike Bismeyer: 00:19:28

It made me understand someone saw it.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:19:29

You know, I finally had my little breakdown with my parents,

Mike Bismeyer: 00:19:32

told them what was going on.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:19:33

But, you know, it just made me think of things different, right?

Mike Bismeyer: 00:19:35

And so, actually, you know, I came up with this idea.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:19:38

I started bringing my sandwich in my pencil box and hiding it, and

Mike Bismeyer: 00:19:40

I started to bring a dummy lunch.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:19:42

And, uh, and the bully threw it away a few times and, uh,

Mike Bismeyer: 00:19:45

and I wasn't reacting as much.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:19:47

Oh, you didn't give him the payback he wanted.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:19:48

He eventually moved on.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:19:50

Yeah.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:19:50

And unfortunately to someone else, but for me, you know, and, and so, you know.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:19:54

But that put in your heart, you know, the importance of that, right?

Mike Bismeyer: 00:19:56

Of stepping up for someone or, or, or pointing out the right thing or also

Mike Bismeyer: 00:19:59

not being afraid to talk about it.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:20:00

And that's really, I mean, communication is the key to everything we do in life.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:20:03

Yeah.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:20:03

Uh, and then, you know, I, uh, one of my early transit companies, I

Mike Bismeyer: 00:20:06

was fortunate to be on the, um, the original panel people originated the

Mike Bismeyer: 00:20:10

United to End Bullying Foundation.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:20:12

Um, you know, we were in a town where there was a horrible bullying

Mike Bismeyer: 00:20:14

incident where a young lady took her life, Amanda Todd, it's a story that's

Mike Bismeyer: 00:20:17

viral and people can look that up.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:20:19

But our office was located in the community and had a big impact.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:20:21

We thought, like, what can we do to make a difference?

Mike Bismeyer: 00:20:23

And at that time, we were selling a product into the school bus world.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:20:26

And we started with a coloring contest and, and, uh, having an opportunity

Mike Bismeyer: 00:20:29

for kids to win money for a grant at their school to spread kindness.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:20:32

And it just grew and grew.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:20:33

And when I left that company, you know, we were giving away 50, 000 a year in grants.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:20:36

Wow.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:20:37

A thousand, $2,000 chunks.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:20:38

And I was so proud I became the spokesperson.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:20:40

I'd go to the schools, give those help.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:20:42

Yeah.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:20:42

But it's very empowering to have kids talk about it.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:20:45

And then I'd really like to thank Paul.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:20:46

I know we've had a great rapport and you've become a

Mike Bismeyer: 00:20:49

great mentor for me as well.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:20:51

But I do want to say it's great to finally get you on this side of the border and,

Mike Bismeyer: 00:20:54

you know, we don't want to let you go.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:20:55

We want to keep Canadianizing you.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:20:56

I know you got to go to a hockey game last night, which...

Mike Bismeyer: 00:20:59

Really excited.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:20:59

And we brought them good luck, I think.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:21:00

We brought them good luck, yeah, and uh, you know, we're looking forward to it.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:21:03

You know, for those that don't know, you know, we're, we

Mike Bismeyer: 00:21:05

have two conferences a year.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:21:07

The next one for us is the spring in Halifax.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:21:09

Uh, that's our, you know, sort of our networking, uh, and session

Mike Bismeyer: 00:21:12

event, which is usually a fantastic, Halifax is a wonderful place.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:21:15

So, on behalf of all the Canadians, uh, thanks for, for coming here, and on

Mike Bismeyer: 00:21:18

behalf of CUTA and the business members.

Mike Bismeyer: 00:21:20

Thank you, Mike.

Tris Hussey: 00:21:24

Hi, this is Tris Hussey editor of the transit unplugged podcast.

Tris Hussey: 00:21:27

And thank you for listening to this week's show.

Tris Hussey: 00:21:30

Special, thanks to our guests, Marco D'Angelo, and our regular

Tris Hussey: 00:21:33

contributor, Mike Bismeyer.

Tris Hussey: 00:21:35

Now coming up next week on the show, we're staying in Edmonton.

Tris Hussey: 00:21:38

Where Paul is interviewing Eddie Robar, deputy city manager in

Tris Hussey: 00:21:41

Edmonton and Carrie Hotten McDonald, who now runs Edmonton transit.

Tris Hussey: 00:21:45

They're going to be talking about hydrogen powered buses.

Tris Hussey: 00:21:48

While you're listening to the show.

Tris Hussey: 00:21:49

If you could do us a favor and rate and review Transit Unplugged,

Tris Hussey: 00:21:53

wherever you listen to podcasts.

Tris Hussey: 00:21:55

We'd really appreciate it.

Tris Hussey: 00:21:57

Rating and reviewing the show helps other people become part of our

Tris Hussey: 00:22:00

transit enthusiastic community.

Tris Hussey: 00:22:03

If you have a question comment.

Tris Hussey: 00:22:04

Or would even like to be on the show.

Tris Hussey: 00:22:06

You can email us anytime@infoattransitunplugged.com.

Tris Hussey: 00:22:11

Transit Unplugged is brought to you by Modaxo.

Tris Hussey: 00:22:14

At Modaxo we're passionate about moving the world's people

Tris Hussey: 00:22:17

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Tris Hussey: 00:22:19

We're passionate about telling those stories.

Tris Hussey: 00:22:21

So until next week ride safe and ride happy.